Subject: Re: Chanute's treasury of early flight dreamers and tinkerers
Rick Masters forwarded an excellent resource on Chanute's book:
Progress in Flying Machines One may start at page 1 https://www.loc.gov/resource/gcfr.0069/?sp=1 There
are over 300 pages of Chanute's good work. About: Personal name Chanute,
Octave, 1832-1910.
Main title Progress in flying machines, by O.
Chanute, C.E.
Published/Created New York, The American Engineer and
Railroad Journal [1894] ============================== Full book with
allowance to download individual pages as needed for study and public sharing!
Group: AirborneWindEnergy
Message: 23178
From: dave santos
Date: 11/3/2017
Subject: Concept Refinement for a Looping Turbine-on-a-Wing FlyGen under a Pi
This
is not a new idea in Open-AWE, since KiteLab Ilwaco came up with the
concept over 5 years ago, actually testing a crude prototype, but using
a friction-brake on the wing-turbine to stand in for a flygen
electrical load. This was not considered a primary contender for
an AWES solution, but as a radically simplified version of
Makani's turbine-on-a-wing down-select. The basic idea dates back to
Payne, Loyd, and others, but endless variations are possible. Since
Makani continues to insist its still on track with its M600, despite
all outside doubts, this concept space remains in play.
In
this case, of the Open-AWE workaround is to create an even hotter
"cleaner" wing than Makani, with a single flygen turbine. Its
reasoned on various grounds that a smaller scale ~10kW is the
unit-scale sweet-spot (if any) for this sort of AWES, but with
denser network packing in airspace to compensate. Only the flygen and
controller, and perhaps an AoA servo channel, is needed on the
wing. Electrical power is carried down a conductor by a
swivel slip-ring contact to islolate tether from looping
twist. The pilot-kite provides the autopilot capability, and the
rig is flown by conventional kite methods by the pilot-in-command. The
short bridles are worth fairing.
Its worth
repeating that a pilot-kite supporting a power wing not only saves
money and radically simplifies control and safety of a hot
wing, but also adds to the power capacity by offsetting the parasitic
cost of the extra mass of a hot rigid wing. The looping path can
also be quite tighter and higher-on-average, with a desirable
higher-frequency cycle. This may the ideal 100W AWES, since small
flygens are not so scaling-law challenged as large.
Open-AWE_IP-Cloud
Group: AirborneWindEnergy
Message: 23179
From: dave santos
Date: 11/3/2017
Subject: Re: Concept Refinement for a Looping Turbine-on-a-Wing FlyGen under
Remarking
the interesting potential to also drive this AWES in motor-mode, with
no wind. It could in principle motor around aloft like a powered
paraglider during lulls, and also somehow launch and land under power,
using prop-guards and wheels like powered paragliders do. The hybrid of
fabric soft-kite tethered to rigid motor-glider may prove
a practical realization of the classic two-kite dream.
Many unusual flight modes are possible, like VTOL of the
motor-glider (turbine-on-a-wing) also surface-parked while the
soft-kite (pilot-kite) stays ready aloft. In effect, a
powered kite vehicle may do almost anywhere what kite surfers
do along shorelines.
If the turbine-on-a-wing is really a useful aerospace idea, it should also compete on a tower as an alternative HAWT.
This
is not a new idea in Open-AWE, since KiteLab Ilwaco came up with the
concept over 5 years ago, actually testing a crude prototype, but using
a friction-brake on the wing-turbine to stand in for a flygen
electrical load. This was not considered a primary contender for
an AWES solution, but as a radically simplified version of
Makani's turbine-on-a-wing down-select. The basic idea dates back to
Payne, Loyd, and others, but endless variations are possible. Since
Makani continues to insist its still on track with its M600, despite
all outside doubts, this concept space remains in play.
In
this case, of the Open-AWE workaround is to create an even hotter
"cleaner" wing than Makani, with a single flygen turbine. Its
reasoned on various grounds that a smaller scale ~10kW is the
unit-scale sweet-spot (if any) for this sort of AWES, but with
denser network packing in airspace to compensate. Only the flygen and
controller, and perhaps an AoA servo channel, is needed on the
wing. Electrical power is carried down a conductor by a
swivel slip-ring contact to islolate tether from looping
twist. The pilot-kite provides the autopilot capability, and the
rig is flown by conventional kite methods by the pilot-in-command. The
short bridles are worth fairing.
Its
worth repeating that a pilot-kite supporting a power wing not only
saves money and radically simplifies control and safety of a
hot wing, but also adds to the power capacity by offsetting the
parasitic cost of the extra mass of a hot rigid wing. The
looping path can also be quite tighter and higher-on-average, with
a desirable higher-frequency cycle. This may the ideal 100W AWES, since
small flygens are not so scaling-law challenged as large.
Open-AWE_IP-Cloud
Group: AirborneWindEnergy
Message: 23180
From: Joe Faust
Date: 11/4/2017
Subject: Raised in the air above Cologny hanging on a kite (1844)
Subject: Translating Kites XC across an Anchor-Field
In
early Forum posts the idea was posed that a kite could travel
anywhere by sending out glider-drones to establish new surface anchors,
including sea-anchors, to haul against. An ideal system
would of course tap AWE, but could be driven many other ways.
This concept was playfully called "seven-league-boots". Bolonkin
has the closest patent IP for a static-legged scheme, and Pete Lynn
shared a sort of one-legged version. Steerable tether-dragging
developed for arctic ballooning is also prior art, but the general
field is still quite virgin.
To update the
foundational architectural analysis, lets add kite
translation across an established anchor field, where drones might fly
up to the translating kite with the new tethers. Lets class
boots-mode as "Spider-Man", and anchor-field tether-mode as "Tarzan",
as intuitive models. Note also the potential of complex XC mixed
modes, and also a single pick-and-place link, like a kite-ferry to
cross a river crosswind from a single upwind anchor. This general
method of translation could move unprecedented massive bulky payloads
through the air.
Open-AWE_IP-Cloud
Group: AirborneWindEnergy
Message: 23182
From: dave santos
Date: 11/5/2017
Subject: Multi-span Kite Arches
Once
again, an overlooked major AWES topology surfaces to formal
analysis, since we are apparently still in early phases of AWES
classification. There are a few partial or weak precedents for the
rotating multi-span kite arches identified here,
like non-rotating barrage-balloon arrays, and a few
hobby-kite multi-spans. Multi-span kite arches have not been
specifically identified before in AWE, to my best knowledge, but
may be a key scaling means. Just picture a wider regular arch with
anchor-tethers added all along it between the end-anchors.
Ever
since Payne proposed a mile-wide AWE arch almost fifty years ago, we
have been overawed by that bold unit-scale assumption. Its likely
km unit-scale is closer to the design sweet spot, given ground-handling
challenges and FAA 2000ft altitude limits. Years of kite farm
architectural study suggests that AWES arrays should rotate in a thin
line, to conserve resources and avoid wake loss/interference effects.
Its proposed that active belay from anchor to anchor is as workable as
all the established industrial cases of trains hitching, cranes
hooking, and so on. Given these assumptions, a multi-span kite arch
topology seems desirable, much as multi-spans are an ancient bridge
lateral scaling means. The advantages are obvious- redundance,
scalability, etc.. The disadvantage is if some single-span economy
of scale is missed.
Once again the question is
whether quasi-heroic "rag-and-string" sailing-in-the-sky methods
can beat the fancy aerospace concepts under development. What an
exciting engineering contest between two impressive contenders.
Even as the high-complexity teams double-down on their
high-tech faith, multi-span kite arches hereby enter the
low-complexity AWE school quiver, double-down on reliance on simple
belay. Reminder that the low-complexity AWE
paradigm abstracts high TRL COTS components as
"simple", to the degree they are ready solutions, like say an
electric car based AWES. Nothing in AWE is simpler than
rag-and-string; porototype kiteplanes, by contrast, are bleeding-edge
complex.
Open-AWE_IP-Cloud
Group: AirborneWindEnergy
Message: 23183
From: dave santos
Date: 11/5/2017
Subject: Giant Kite-Flying Androids
Here
is a cool AWES concept, fully workable in principle; honoring
Wubbo's vision that we can create whatever kind of AWE we choose,
rather than be enslaved
to boring industrial-utilitarianism-
Giant
Kite-Flying Humanoid Robots could imitate human kite-flyer dynamics,
which are still superior to all our crude AWES dynamics.
Yes, android kite flying is definitely a high-complexity
approach, however, humanoid robots developed generally are in
principle able to fly kites, and duplicate many other human
behaviors (young Pocock marveled that even rocks somehow know
how to fly kites, if not at kite-pro level)
Our unique challenge as kite technologists is not the giant android, but its kite, with associated unicorn-garden :)
Group: AirborneWindEnergy
Message: 23184
From: dave santos
Date: 11/5/2017
Subject: Re: Giant Kite-Flying Androids
Proof that the hobby kite world is far in advance of any AWE venture-
Designed and built by Jim Potts and Phil?? Northern Kite Group (NKG) Flyin in, 2005 at Haslingden, Lancs. A radi...
Here
is a cool AWES concept, fully workable in principle; honoring
Wubbo's vision that we can create whatever kind of AWE we choose,
rather than be enslaved
to boring industrial-utilitarianism-
Giant
Kite-Flying Humanoid Robots could imitate human kite-flyer dynamics,
which are still superior to all our crude AWES dynamics.
Yes, android kite flying is definitely a high-complexity
approach, however, humanoid robots developed generally are in
principle able to fly kites, and duplicate many other human
behaviors (young Pocock marveled that even rocks somehow know
how to fly kites, if not at kite-pro level)
Our unique challenge as kite technologists is not the giant android, but its kite, with associated unicorn-garden :)
Group: AirborneWindEnergy
Message: 23185
From: dave santos
Date: 11/5/2017
Subject: Kite-Train Lattice Waves (video)
A
kit- train in a fresh breeze will develop strong lattice waves.
Here is a nice video of two trains side-by-side. These hobby kiters
have to know what they are doing, one of their
trains even known to have uprooted a fire hydrant,
nevertheless, many toy kites can be tamed as one easier than a single
kite of comparable area.
Note how the waves
travel down the train from the most-excited upper region. Consider how
these trains would synchronize if cross-linked, and how elastic
side-guy lines could maintain anti-braid stability. Each kite is
sweeping an eight pattern in perfect coordination with its
neighbors, the same lattice dynamics of perfect crystals made of
identical atoms. Consider how periodic side PTO tag lines along the
train could extract low-complexity crosswind power. Power is far
trickier to extract at the anchor, since the multiple waves sum to
nearly constant tension, however, the kites could be phased to pump at
the base by various means.
Obviously a prime
spacious kite field with cool smooth air; these are real kite
folks practicing at a high level. Kevlar tether is commonly paired
to the cheapest kites by this global kite-train subculture of perhaps a
hundred or so souls-
A pleasant evening at Otterspool saw members of the Northern Kite Group flying a pair of kite trains. The trains...
Group: AirborneWindEnergy
Message: 23186
From: joe_f_90032
Date: 11/5/2017
Subject: Re: Multi-span Kite Arches
Early
in forum we had mention by me of a surround-earth multi-span kite
system; I had a drawing; you commented that you thought also that it
was feasible.
For years I've had the following as index.html matter:
"Kite
energy systems are machines performing practical works, producing
energy for tertiary uses, or otherwise enhancing the universe.
Technical energy kite machines consist of cooperative sets: anchor set,
tether set, wing set. The anchor set and tether set may also be viewed
as wing sets. Such machines are studied at all scales from very
tiny to world-surround."
The "world-surround" is because we covered some multi-span kite system concepts that indeed proposed full earth-surround.
Also,
we have had coverage toward "fences" that have multi-span; the count of
posts of the fence was left unlimited; the count of rungs or runners of
wings in the fence kite system was left indefinite; such fences are
multi-span kite systems. PTO varies.
That page featured a second kind of surround-earth where the multi-span occurred without tethers to the ground.
Group: AirborneWindEnergy
Message: 23190
From: joe_f_90032
Date: 11/5/2017
Subject: Re: Multi-span Kite Arches
Joe Faust<Notes@energykitesystems.net
Group: AirborneWindEnergy
Message: 23191
From: andrew@airhes.com
Date: 11/9/2017
Subject: Re: Air HES http://airhes.com/
Dave, thanks for your remarks.
BTW, about
albedo: we suppose that the AirHES will use only bottom part of clouds
in order not to influence on integral albedo of clouds that defined by
the upper parts of clouds.
Group: AirborneWindEnergy
Message: 23192
From: Joe Faust
Date: 11/9/2017
Subject: Cloud albedo
Cloud albedo
======================
Teased by a post by AirHES
this topic thread may hold a study of cloud albedo and AWES.
Keep in mind daylight albedo cools the
planet by reflecting sunlight back to space while night albedo traps
surface heat. Therefore night cloud harvest is favored to reverse
global warming. The same principle applies in reverse with cloud
creation, including jet con trails.
--------------------------------------------
The Kite Experiment, 19 October 1752 The Kite Experiment I.
Printed in The Pennsylvania Gazette, October 19, 1752; also copy: The
Royal Society. II. Printed in Joseph Priestley, The History and Present
State of Electricity, with Original Experiments (London, 1767), pp.
179–81
One
of their comments: "To dispel another myth, Franklin’s kite was not
struck by lightning. If it had been, he probably would have been
electrocuted, experts say. Instead, the kite picked up the ambient
electrical charge from the storm."
==============================================
Anyone over time may advance this topic and also relate comments of topic to AWE.
Group: AirborneWindEnergy
Message: 23200
From: Muzhichkov
Date: 11/12/2017
Subject: Back to wire energy transfer
Hallo everybody!
Maybe
I will seem a bore, but I would like to raise the topic again with the
transfer of electricity from the aeroborn down. As you know, I've made
a online calculator (http://www.enornis.com/webapplication/) to make
estimation of a system with electricity generator upstairs. So, if I
choose:
Aluminium as material for cable,
500m high (with 30grad incline means 2000m),
1,5 mm2 wire cross-section,
generator power 3,8kW (for example V=15m/s, D1=3m,
and 600V voltage (it's possible for standart isolation for such a thin cable)
I become just 40% losses of voltage and energy,
and this is with just 8,1kg weigh of cable (without insulation)
With such parameters it is possible to live!!!
Group: AirborneWindEnergy
Message: 23201
From: dave santos
Date: 11/12/2017
Subject: Re: Multi-span Kite Arches
Agreed;
many multi-span kite cases and concepts are known. This thread is
specifically to identify multi-spans as a powerful scaling topology for
large kitefarms, where single arches are not enough to span the
available crosswind extent.
Since AWES
topology is still a new study, we are still defining
basic terms, so we start with "brush", "comb",
"drop-stitch", train, arch, etc., topologies, and multi-span
arch is a natural extension of the basic set. JoeF invokes here a
major Fence Topology, which we can define
as commonly multi-span, but still distinguish from arch
spans by stating that a kite fence's spans
intuitively follow close to (skirts) the surface like
any common fence, while an arch spans (soars) over the surface,
with large empty spaces. In AWES design, an arch targets upper
wind, while a fence also engages surface flow. Usage of "fence" to
describe an upper arch or line-run may now be superseded.
These
are fuzzy classifications, with intermediate cases; not to be
applied too strictly as we assign semantics to our kite architectures.
Joe Faust<Notes@energykitesystems.net
Group: AirborneWindEnergy
Message: 23202
From: dave santos
Date: 11/12/2017
Subject: Re: Back to wire energy transfer
Hi Alex
Its only boring if you do not write.
What
is your insulation mass fraction estimate? Many common wires weigh more
in insulation than conductor. Separate conductors are natural for
networked kites with many lines. One massive pair of conductors
with its own kite-lift could serve a large array. kPower has lifted
conventional extension cords to raise AC power up, which can tolerate
some overvoltage. Naked electric fence wire is a good balance of
strength and conductance. Keep in mind cold temperature allows
more current, and its colder high up.
Did you mean 5000m high or 200m tilted?
daveS
On Sunday, November 12, 2017 4:44 AM, "muzhichkov@yahoo.com [AirborneWindEnergy]" <AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com
Hallo everybody!
Maybe
I will seem a bore, but I would like to raise the topic again with the
transfer of electricity from the aeroborn down. As you know, I've made
a online calculator (http://www.enornis.com/webapplication/) to make
estimation of a system with electricity generator upstairs. So, if I
choose:
Aluminium as material for cable,
500m high (with 30grad incline means 2000m),
1,5 mm2 wire cross-section,
generator power 3,8kW (for example V=15m/s, D1=3m,
and 600V voltage (it's possible for standart isolation for such a thin cable)
I become just 40% losses of voltage and energy,
and this is with just 8,1kg weigh of cable (without insulation)
With such parameters it is possible to live!!!
Group: AirborneWindEnergy
Message: 23203
From: dave santos
Date: 11/13/2017
Subject: Lingering Magenn Mysteries?
It
was thought Magenn was content to fade away, having raised millions for
an impractical AWES concept, but in reviewing AlexM's AWE app, this odd
rumor stood out- "Magenn, the financial director committed suicide". A
quick search did not hit on any confirming source, so maybe AlexM can
point us in the right direction. That's just one mystery; search did
turn up current Magenn data, further confusing the picture-
Chief Financial Officer Company Name: Magenn Power Inc. Dates Employed: Oct 2005 – Present Employment Duration: 12 yrs 2 mos
===================================
Highlight green on "Present" is mine.
Group: AirborneWindEnergy
Message: 23205
From: dave santos
Date: 11/13/2017
Subject: Re: Lingering Magenn Mysteries?
Looks like its auto-updated to calculate term from start to "present".
On Monday, November 13, 2017 4:54 PM, "Joe Faust joefaust333@gmail.com
[AirborneWindEnergy]" <AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com
Chief Financial Officer Company Name: Magenn Power Inc. Dates Employed: Oct 2005 – Present Employment Duration: 12 yrs 2 mos
===================================
Highlight green on "Present" is mine.
Group: AirborneWindEnergy
Message: 23206
From: Joe Faust
Date: 11/13/2017
Subject: Re: Lingering Magenn Mysteries?
Probably as you indicated.
==========================
Dale George declares past:
Dale George Production Manager Company Name MAGENN Power Inc. Dates Employed Mar 2009 – Sep 2011 Employment Duration •2 yrs 7 mos Location Ottawa, Canada Area Go-to-guy
on all design, build, proto-typing and deployment of the world's first
high altitude wind turbine. see, "Infinite Winds", Discovery Channel,
Planet Earth series
Group: AirborneWindEnergy
Message: 23207
From: dave santos
Date: 11/13/2017
Subject: Curious Mass-equivalences of Wings in Flow
Mass is defined in terms of inertia and
gravity effects. Kites have a curious relation to mass. The normal part
is a kite's rest-mass, in practice what the kite weighs on a scale. A
kite in nominal lift mode pulls upward, reducing the weight a scale
sees to negative-mass or negative-gravity values. A kite can also
produce increased inertial mass readings, by a sort of virtual mass. A
wing resists translation in heave dimension, as if it had added
inertial mass, but does not resist so much in surge or sway dimensions.
A tethered wing especially resists tethered to Earth. This is a
remarkable extension of the Earth's own mass, by means of string.
Another odd case is a kite parked on the surface by reversed AoA, as
Revs are parked. They actually are pushing downward, in effect adding
virtual mass to rest mass.
An strict interpretation common in QM physics is to respect whatever is
measured as such, and a kite truly produces exotic statistical
mechanics, never mind how ordinary most folks consider kites. The Higgs
Mechanism explains how mass accrues to particles. Since a Higgs Boson
has recently been confirmed by the LHC, this is considered established
science. How do scientists try to explain the Higgs mechanism to
layfolk? In his book on the subject, Physicist Sean Carroll describes a
vacuum chamber with "little robots...each...equipped with sail".
Evacuated, the robots move about freely, but add air, and they acquire
a mass effect. "The robots are particles," he goes on, "and their sails
are their couplings to the Higgs Field, which is represented by air. My
colleagues at Caltech in engineering and aeronautics (said) "that
sounds awesome"".
Just so, the kite has been leading us into the same analog particle
physics, like knowledge miners connecting from opposite directions. Its
never been a problem that some folks balk at any comparison of kites
with particle physics; our pleasure is over the same dynamics as these
Caltech folks admire. That AWES kite experts gained the same new
insights at almost the same time as professional physicists is sweet.
There is plenty of new engineering science to develop from the
identification of the kite as a particle physics analog. QM even
requires complex-mass effects, and its going to be fun to identify the
kite's version. Its an open question if AWE will succeed by the limited
engineering physics most developers presume, or if the vast
intellectual edifice of advanced physics will prove decisive, as it has
for semiconductors. We have barely begun to understand kites, and what
they can do, but already different perspectives can agree, its
"awesome".
Group: AirborneWindEnergy
Message: 23208
From: joe_f_90032
Date: 11/13/2017
Subject: Re: Curious Mass-equivalences of Wings in Flow
"There
is plenty of new engineering science to develop from the identification
of the kite as a particle physics analog." was added with dated
credit to
There is a proliferation trend of AWE
market studies of generally low domain expertise. This one is fairly
typical, excepting the odd prominence of Bruce Banks Sails, a seemingly
non-AWE conventional sailmaker. Perhaps there is something new here-
Subject: Re: Curious Mass-equivalences of Wings in Flow
To make Carrol's Higgs analogy as clear
as possible; he is invoking a towed wing in air, and the air itself is
the Higgs Field. The robotic sailing vehicle is a particle that excites
the Higgs Field by it sail, to acquire mass. The analog Higgs Boson is
the wind-in-the-sail. We have no problem seeing the kite topology
implicit in this analogy. Earth corresponds to the tow vehicle for a
sail or kite wing, and we can interpret the wind field as the static
POV and Earth as moving, under Galilean Relativity. From the
static-Earth POV, wind can be seen as a quasi-aether flow.
While aether is specifically discredited as a static medium for 19th
century light propagation physics, it lives on in wonderful
mythological and misc scientific discourse, and is worthy of its own
Forum topic in relation to theoretic AWE, since aether's primary
ancient physical meaning was "upper wind" (Wikipedia). We now know the
solar system is filled with rarified gas/plasma, including solar wind
for solar kites, and there is no such thing as a true classical vacuum,
nor any definite kite boundary between our atmosphere and space.
Group: AirborneWindEnergy
Message: 23212
From: dave santos
Date: 11/14/2017
Subject: Quasi-Aether in AWES Theory
Here's the Wikipedia Aether line-up. Note
the many rich intuitive correspondences with AWES theory, which will be
discussed in follow-on postings-
Sorry, but my full-featured Yahoo mailer
has bogged down my dinky CPU with ads and features, so I am resorting
to basic mail mode and my links are not hot meanwhile.
--------------------------------------------
Group: AirborneWindEnergy
Message: 23216
From: joe_f_90032
Date: 11/14/2017
Subject: Re: Fort Felker's AWEC2017 presentation video
My first viewing notes:
1. Still Fort does not recognize the several conferences before 2010. Why is that?
There were others before that. Even he big one in 2009 in California, USA, was not the first.
2. Go after knowing a full spectrum of load cases for one's AWES.
4.Fatigue optimization will come in time, not during prototyping and learning ...
5. Recognize and respect human fatigue also.
6.
He does not believe small scale can have significant impact on "global
warming" (he favored that phrase over "climate change".
7. He'd have us say "kite plant" to our buyers of MW systems.
8. Business Challenges at MW scale ==============
High cost of product development Typical low margins in energy business High Cost of initial low=rate production Achieving Bankability Environmental Impact Expectation of warranties on performance and reliability Certification
9. Makani:
Next year: Hawaii 2018 ======================= 10. We heard a bit more about crashes and crashing.
11, Stay testing small ...
===========================.
Group: AirborneWindEnergy
Message: 23217
From: joe_f_90032
Date: 11/14/2017
Subject: Kite Plant Operating for One Continuous Year
Kite Plant Operating for One Continuous Year
Preliminary Draft of Rules:
1. Autonomous landings and launches during the year. The kite plant might need to land and launch many times during the year.
2. Produces average of 1 MW of energy for 1000 hours in the base year.
3. ?
4. ?
Group: AirborneWindEnergy
Message: 23218
From: joe_f_90032
Date: 11/14/2017
Subject: How Might Small AWES Significantly Impact World Energy Supply
How Might Small AWES Significantly Impact World Energy Supply
=================================================
Fort
does not want to work on less than 1 MW kite plants. He believes small
AWES cannot have a significant impact on world energy supply, if I
heard him correctly. In any case, this topic thread welcomes
arguments for how small AWES might significantly impact world energy
supply.
=================================================
To prime the discussion, I'd put forward some points:
1. Multiply the units as needed.
2. The educational value of small AWES may be the decisive matter for having AWES adopted in the large.
3. Have nearly everyone go outside and fly AWES instead of burning units of energy on indoor appliances.
Subject: Re: Kite Plant Operating for One Continuous Year
There is hidden economic bias in this
test, in that GoogleX can prevail by brute spending, but still not
count for much. A different sort of test is suggested by the Wright
Bros. The major milestone for AWES architectures that ultimately
prevail is the moment of proof-of-concept, and the key endurance
milestone is survival-to-payback, which varies greatly between
architectures. There is no magic one-year criteria; its a dumbed-down
analysis.
kPower's two-week all-modes looping foil session, only stopped due to
schedule constraints, still seems to be the endurance record in AWE,
but at ~25W prototype scale. It could have gone on for the four years
since, had kPower been able to afford to buy kFarm when it went for
sale (200k USD, pocket change for Google). What truly counts is
potential, and little is lost by not doing a feat that reasonably could
be done, as long as the lesson is learned. Sooner or later, R&D
funding to loop a ship-kite as an AWES will be applied, and MW output
is expected.
Even if the M600 were heroically operated for a year, its expected
net-power-out is dismally far from MW level. SkySails did in fact
operate its ship-kite AWES at sea several years, and no disputes the MW
scale boost to propulsion. "Kite Plant" does seem like a good
term-of-art, suggesting AWE more than "kitefarm", the previous coinage.
A diligent fly-off process remains best-practice to sort out winners
and losers in aerospace, but don't expect GoogleX to willingly compete
in that format, when its dominance is in capital and mindshare. Makani
narratives as a whole seem aimed at somehow dumping the venture at a
good price to any credulous new investor, as Google has done with other
X turkeys. A diversified AWES testing program and sound milestone
criteria are not expected.
Group: AirborneWindEnergy
Message: 23221
From: dave santos
Date: 11/15/2017
Subject: Re: How Might Small AWES Significantly Impact World Energy Supply
Once again, dubious logic, that an
economic kite-plant unit must be MW scale. Solar PV is based on solar
cells with at most a few watts output each, aggregated into panels then
arrays. Solar Thermal mirrors and collectors are not much higher in
unit-power.
Fort neglects to note that, in principle, small kites in vast networked
arrays can aggregate into GW scale plants, just as solar units do.
Group: AirborneWindEnergy
Message: 23222
From: dave santos
Date: 11/15/2017
Subject: Fort's "Valley of Despair"
An interesting commentary of Fort's at
AWEC2017 regards the notorious "valley of despair" effect in technology
development. Without saying so too bluntly, he was obviously referring
to turmoil within Makani experienced first-hand. We have had previous
indications, like an ex-employee anonymously reporting internal "angst"
on an employment website. The despair is related to technical choice,
in that high-complexity AWE is predictably high-risk AWE. We can
imagine the soul-searching that may have resulted if M600's maiden
flight crashed, ten years in. Makani has been so troubled that hardly
anyone has lasted the whole ten years, except Andrea the photographer,
whose cameras at least are robust.
The funny thing is that Open-AWE is much less subject to technical
despair, given its faith in KIS. Yes, there is some chronic pain to
limited budgets, but in the long run cheaper systems result compared to
over-funded "gold-plated" ventures, where folks jump out windows when
everything crashes down. In countless DIY AWES experiments, joy is the
general experience, since most experiments advance knowledge and get
one out into nature. The occasional setback is more comedic slapstick
than sad. Hope instantly returns for tomorrow's test. The faint shadow
on DIY AWE happiness is the potential for death or physical injury,
like skiing, say. Its still simply a great joy.
Despair is healthy emotion when it leads to changing course from a
doomed path to an open path. Its always an emotional distraction when
bad outcomes happen. Surely Fort and team are consoled considerably by
good salary and benefits, but such consolation also keeps them on the
high-complexity "path of infinite pain", rather than radically change
course. The lowly Wright Bros were never so happy as when they solved
problem after problem, with no despair-factor (even as Langley and
Maxim despaired). That's the "right stuff".