Messages in AirborneWindEnergy group.                           AWES15855to15905 Page 212 of 440.

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15855 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 11/3/2014
Subject: Re: VESTAS AWE Watch

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15856 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 11/3/2014
Subject: Re: VESTAS AWE Watch

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15857 From: mmarchitti Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Re: KitVes

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15858 From: mmarchitti Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Re: KitVes

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15859 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Re: Kite basis for customer-delivery v. Amazon, DHL, Google, etc.

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15860 From: dave santos Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Re: KitVes

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15861 From: Joe Faust Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Basic Research and AWE

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15862 From: Joe Faust Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Re: Basic Research and AWE

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15863 From: Joe Faust Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Re: Basic Research and AWE

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15864 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Re: VESTAS AWE Watch

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15865 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Re: kites make safe

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15866 From: dave santos Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Re: Basic Research and AWE

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15867 From: dave santos Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Re: kites make safe

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15868 From: dave santos Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Phugoid Oscillation in Towed-Quadcopter

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15869 From: Pierre BENHAIEM Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Re: KitVes

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15870 From: dave santos Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Caped-Quadcopter (kite hybrid)

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15871 From: Bruno M. Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Alaska Launches Flying Wind Turbines

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15872 From: dave santos Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Sept. TUDelft AWE Gathering (EU "mission-accomplished" AWE science p

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15873 From: Joe Faust Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: At EPFL

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15874 From: Joe Faust Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: KitePower Publications at TU Delft

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15875 From: stephane rousson Date: 11/5/2014
Subject: l' Aerosail soutenu par Redbull !

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15876 From: mmarchitti Date: 11/5/2014
Subject: Re: KitVes

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15877 From: Joe Faust Date: 11/5/2014
Subject: Re: KitVes

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15878 From: dave santos Date: 11/5/2014
Subject: Re: KitVes

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15879 From: Pierre BENHAIEM Date: 11/5/2014
Subject: Re: KitVes

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15880 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 11/5/2014
Subject: AWE Community Collaboration

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15881 From: dave santos Date: 11/5/2014
Subject: Re: KitVes

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15882 From: dave santos Date: 11/5/2014
Subject: Essential Flight Stability for AWES

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15883 From: dave santos Date: 11/5/2014
Subject: Re: AWE Community Collaboration

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15884 From: Pierre BENHAIEM Date: 11/5/2014
Subject: Re: KitVes

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15885 From: Pierre BENHAIEM Date: 11/5/2014
Subject: Re: Essential Flight Stability for AWES

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15886 From: Rod Read Date: 11/6/2014
Subject: kite winch anchoring

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15887 From: dave santos Date: 11/6/2014
Subject: Re: Essential Flight Stability for AWES

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15888 From: dave santos Date: 11/6/2014
Subject: Re: KitVes

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15889 From: Joe Faust Date: 11/6/2014
Subject: Tethers Serving and Generating?

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15890 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 11/6/2014
Subject: Re: kite winch anchoring

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15891 From: Joe Faust Date: 11/6/2014
Subject: Rock Kiting

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15892 From: dave santos Date: 11/6/2014
Subject: Conductive AWES Stages

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15893 From: dave santos Date: 11/6/2014
Subject: What is a "Kite-Mesh"? (disambiguation) What is it good for?

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15894 From: Rod Read Date: 11/6/2014
Subject: Re: Tethers Serving and Generating?

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15895 From: Rod Read Date: 11/6/2014
Subject: Re: kite winch anchoring

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15896 From: Pierre BENHAIEM Date: 11/6/2014
Subject: Re: KitVes

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15897 From: dave santos Date: 11/6/2014
Subject: Re: KitVes

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15898 From: Rod Read Date: 11/6/2014
Subject: Whale baleen as AWES power model

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15900 From: Rod Read Date: 11/6/2014
Subject: Re: Whale baleen as AWES power model

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15901 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 11/6/2014
Subject: Powered Aircraft Pilots on Parker Ranch Airspace

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15902 From: dave santos Date: 11/6/2014
Subject: Re: KitVes

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15903 From: dave santos Date: 11/6/2014
Subject: Re: Powered Aircraft Pilots on Parker Ranch Airspace

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15904 From: Joe Faust Date: 11/6/2014
Subject: Re: Powered Aircraft Pilots on Parker Ranch Airspace

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15905 From: benhaiemp Date: 11/6/2014
Subject: Re: AWES for electricity production in utility-scale? Turbines integ




Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15855 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 11/3/2014
Subject: Re: VESTAS AWE Watch
So, maybe "Vestas" might be a code term for "big wind and government wind" where a watch would expose AWE changes in big wind world.  That is, watching for actions in conventional wind that indicate AWE involvement.  One company that holds about a fifth of world's conventional wind turbines to its credit up to turbine manufacturing --Vestas-- was set apart to see if it could be a canary-vitality test scene; perhaps that one company will ride out the momentum of conventional wind without upgrading to AWE while new AWE companies serve and grow.   Actions by any conventional wind company that AWE nod would be welcome in this topic thread. 

Along such line, I put in a 2009 detail by Vestas in the patent space where they forward LTA in a teaching about using LTA for turbine installation. 
Patent EP2272754A1 - Wind turbine generator installation by airship

 


Priority Jun 30, 2009
Also published asPatent CN102803070A - Wind turbine generator installation by airshipEP2443031A1,EP2443031B1US20120091274,https://www.google.com/patents/WO2010145665A1?dq=AIRBORNE+inassignee:Vestas&ei=KvNXVO7lBoO4ogTn5YCgAQ&cl=en

 

I wonder if that Vestas LTA team thought about using tethered non-LTA AWES to effect the same installations, as the sites would have wind!   Lift, Pice-and-Place AWES ?  And during the operation, some accidental spinning and generation might occur ... and presto ... someone might get a change of heart on just how to generate electricity ... without the tower. 

kPower is free to negotiate a sale or other agreement regarding Upper WindPower trade name with North American Windpower publisher.

~ JoeF

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15856 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 11/3/2014
Subject: Re: VESTAS AWE Watch
So far, North American Windpower magazine has given a few nods to AWE:
1. Nod to Makani getting some DOE funds. 
2. Nod to the Altaeros project. 
3. Nod to the wind study showing great wind higher up. 

A watch of NAW North American Windpower: Issue Archive

  will be revealing AWE growth in its awareness.   My guess is that NAW is open to AWE news. 

NAW would not want to miss being the "North American Airborne Wind Energy" organ ... NAAWE. 

~ JoeF

 
Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15857 From: mmarchitti Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Re: KitVes
Manhattan and Apollo projects demonstrate just the opposite.

High Wind Energy tecnology does not need basic research, its standard has been already set, and it is being followed by:


High Wind Energy technology needs industrial management, like the Manhattan and Apollo projects, and not fragmentation.


---In AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com, <santos137@...
Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15858 From: mmarchitti Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Re: KitVes
Manhattan and Apollo projects demonstrate just the opposite.

High Wind Energy tecnology does not need basic research, its standard has been already set, and it is being followed by:


High Wind Energy technology needs industrial management, like the Manhattan and Apollo projects, and not fragmentation.


---In AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com, <santos137@...
Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15859 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Re: Kite basis for customer-delivery v. Amazon, DHL, Google, etc.

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15860 From: dave santos Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Re: KitVes
Mario,

You seem unique in declaring that EU funding has already delivered a "standard" AWES design solution somehow comparable to the Manhattan or Apollo Programs, as represented by a list of small struggling EU projects. Why isn't KiteGen and KiteVes in the winner's circle you listed?

Open-AWE proposes third-party validation testing for TRL-9 gigawatt unit-scale AWES meeting the same industry standards used to measure conventional WECS performance, as well as Airworthiness Certification by FAA/ICAO. Open-AWE leads the way in this concept space, but its still very early,

daveS




Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15861 From: Joe Faust Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Basic Research and AWE

One tack: Have AWE developers look over all basic research results in all sciences and arts to see what might be applied into the AWE realm.   The developers in such action are not doing basic research, but may be doing creative invention in the arts of AWE toward solutions in one or more scale or application. 

Another tack: Have an AWE-realm worker wonder about areas where basic research might uncover something of special value to AWE.  Questions may be formed and shared.  Basic-research scientists might adopt a question's implied space and decide to do basic research in matters that might affect the question's answer or might not! 

Another way: Have on AWE teams those who would keep sifting the results of basic research for things that might affect the team's objectives.  Have also on the AWE team those who will deftly use extant knowledge to construct arrangements that solve needs. While both are operating, record new questions and share the new questions widely and openly, as such questions might inspire other teams.

Basic research does not have practical arrangements in first focus.  
Applied arts may ever improve and may have practicality in first focus; innovation is possible in applied arts where basic-research results invite or support or inspire new or modified arrangements in the arts. 

What extant basic research results have yet to be carefully reviewed for possible use in AWE? Probably most of extant knowledge has yet to be faced by an excited passionate AWE applied artist, IMHO.  What could that:___k_____ have to do with AWE? (where "k" is a bit of knowledge).  Even rapid genius cannot ask pointedly the trillions of questions so formed; but some fortunates will be asking the question for some fruitful replies.   There is plenty of work to be done and plenty of opportunity to be faced; no AWE applied artist need ever moan for lack of new ground to explore.  
       Some reviewers will see the above paragraph as promoting fragmentation in AWE; however, consider knowing that one need not fragment; one person or a team--at any tim--may down select and focus in unity with some defined purpose and project; there is no law against settling into a defined project.  The call here is to consider appreciating that while a party down selects and lives a focus on a project, some missing of other opportunities will occur; but that could be just fine as a project may grow to service life; others may take up other opportunities. 

I applaud that basic research continues in the world. 

Suppose we take exactly what is known and build up AWES and do all we might without looking at any future results of basic research? Assume political will was in place for forwarding AWE into the best AWE could be with what is already known. Assume nearly unending funds were at hand to build out and operate AWES in great ways without requiring any further basic research.
Look at the thousands of practical applications known to exist for AWES.   Have some guiding committee prioritize the applications. What application might get first and robust attention? What applications will be side-lined partially or fully?  Assume the committee chooses traction of ships and utility-scale electrical production as two applications to get rich robust focus. Then which AWE methods would be chosen to effectively build out traction and e-production at utility scale?

Not all AWE workers are the same. The mix may bless/challenge. Tensions may bless.   As soon as a team down selects to a project with a method, then personally I spend time at other fronts and let that team fulfill its down select. 

What are some open questions in AWE?

~ JoeF


Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15862 From: Joe Faust Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Re: Basic Research and AWE
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_skies_research
​Blue Skies Research
may bless AWE. 

may bless AWE. ​  One may record AWE play and then later analyze the play in search of AWE blessings. 

Dream
Load oneself with AWE-related matter. Let oneself dream. Record what one might. Analyze the dreaming results for possible AWE blessings. 

Daydream
and then record what one might; analyze the findings for possible blessing to AWE. 

Brainstorm
Collect brainstorming results. Share them. Then sift and analyze the body of results for possible blessings to AWE. 

~ JoeF

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15863 From: Joe Faust Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Re: Basic Research and AWE
Share. Publish.    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Publishing
Having a matter is no guarantee that one will do best with what one has. Sharing and publishing what one has will give others an opportunity to do something with what one shares; perhaps what others do with the shared seeds will surprise the first holder of the seeds. Plant the seeds widely, as there may be good soil out there!
    This forum is one place to share AWE seeds. Drop inhibitions and spread your seeds into the world. 
~ JoeF​

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15864 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Re: VESTAS AWE Watch
Official:
It is an editorial mandate to cover Airborne Wind Energy at North American Windpower 
magazine. They welcome qualified parties to send AWE news for possible inclusion
and editorial treatment.  

~ JoeF

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15865 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Re: kites make safe
Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15866 From: dave santos Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Re: Basic Research and AWE
AWE is building on grand foundations in engineering-science, mostly by standard methods; but the specific application context, of tapping upper wind for power, requires the most basic research. Its a radical adventure-of-the-spirit, a day-by-day mating of extreme-sport with deep-physics.

To best advance basic engineering research, its essential to down-select carefully, or one never gets anywhere. Both premature down-select and overdue down-select are fatal errors. Premature down-select is to hastily confuse a straw with gold. Overdue down-select occurs when the golden needle is overlooked, and the same haystack must be searched again. Optimal down-select is when the golden needle is carefully found, and the rest of the haystack need not even be searched. We are likely to see all of these possibilities played out in the AWE field.

Yesterday it rained and the wind was blowing 30-50 mph here in Ilwaco. The basic research was to test a small parafoil lifter with a long tube tail on very strong line, as the latest KiteLab Ilwaco "storm-kite". This marks the seventh year of my storm-kite testing here, and the evolved rig is superior in every way, even though daily progress was almost imperceptible.

Today the wind and rain moved on, and the basic research is study of molecular structures on the Net for structure-similarity models for large airborne isotropic lattices. A search of silicon structures (chosen for versatility second only to carbon) led to molecular-sieves (porous crystals), particularly multi-phase aluminosilcates (zeolites), and a wealth of promising rigging schemes resulted than were unknown (to me) just before. The pesky kite-farm boundary is being treated as an anyon feature, with solution similarity between the micro- model and meso- AWES.case, but with no final result clearly in sight, just increasing excitement over the hidden solutions.

Tangible or abstract, the character of basic research is almost imperceptible progress that, when it succeeds, then looks like a giant astounding inventive leaps. In AWE R&D, one must endure the marathon quest for applicable knowledge, and tolerate the varied frustrations as a fine game. Our Golden Age of Basic AWE Research, born from engineering uncertainty, really is piling up answers, and will end soon enough; so enjoy it while you can.




Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15867 From: dave santos Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Re: kites make safe
A small clarification of a FotoKite assertion- "The Fotokite shares fundamental attributes with conventional kites and will likely be regulated as such. In particular, the current FAA UAS roadmap explicitly excludes tethered systems from the definition of UAS."


The FAA has contradictory standards as the old kite and aerostat FARs are superceded by AWES/UAS rules. The key regulatory factors are altitude, conspicuity, mass, and velocity. One cannot just put a tether on an aircraft and suddenly its exempt :)
Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15868 From: dave santos Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Phugoid Oscillation in Towed-Quadcopter

Watch as the towed speed increases the Fotokite tethered-quadcopter increasingly begins to pitch in phugoid mode, even with its considerable active and passive gyro-stabilization factors. Were towed speed to continue to increase to actuation force and latency saturation, a crash would result. SkyWindPower likely faced identical AWES dynamics in high winds, without public disclosure. Its probably a manageable (but critical) design issue, by better controls and early landing in high wind-


Fotokite Sledding test



Aircraft dynamic modes - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 


 


Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15869 From: Pierre BENHAIEM Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Re: KitVes

There is no AWE or HAWE standard _  The standard in wind energy is the 3-bladed HAWT _ because there is no AWES for a next industrial production at scale. And the schemes used by most companies for several years do not appear as promising: the model of farm of unities works for HAWT, but not for AWES due to long tethers. So R&D should go towards unities integrated into a single system maximizing land and space used, avoiding hazards of numerous moving tethers. Actually the biggest kite area is something like 1000 m². Far biggest flying systems should be developped, and probably settled on multiple anchors.

                                                                                                                                               

PierreB

http://flygenkite.com

    

 


Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15870 From: dave santos Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Caped-Quadcopter (kite hybrid)

A tethered or free-flying quadcopter (or other rotor-count VTOL) can be caped (fabric-sail soft-wing) just like known kytoon (winged LTA) variants, for launch-on-demand and climb-to-altitude (into useful wind or soaring conditions), for all general or specialized applications (including AWE). Forced landings could be a passive parachute mode, for fail-safety.


The "caped" metaphor suggests how a fabric-sail might streamer away from the rotors during ferrying phases, but it could also furl or deploy to-and-from a pack in many possible ways, depending on the app.


CC+ 4.x BY NC+ SA Open-AWE Cooperative

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15871 From: Bruno M. Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Alaska Launches Flying Wind Turbines
Seems very on-topic

grts
Bruno
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
http://sourceable.net/alaska-launches-flying-wind-turbines/

Flying Wind Turbines


A city in Alaska is trialling the usage of flying wind turbines to take
advantage of the stronger air currents found at higher altitudes.
The Altaeros Buoyant Airborne Turbine (BAT) looks like a cross between a
windmill and a hollowed-out blimp, consisting of a segmented, tubular
balloon pumped full of helium to confer it with sufficient buoyancy to
float high in the air.

The blades of the Altaeros BAT are situated within the tube’s hollow
interior, while a set of sturdy tethers keep the device anchored to a
relatively constant position above the ground.

The device was designed and built by Altaeros Energy, a start-up founded
by MIT and Harvard alumni which has received a US$1.3 million grant from
the Alaska Energy Authority to trial usage of the BAT over an 18-month
period.

One of the turbines will be installed above the city of Fairbanks,
Alaska at an altitude of just over 300 metres, where it will convey
energy to the ground by means of cables connecting it to the grid.

Altaeros has already conducted successful trials of a 35-foot scale
prototype of the BAT in Limestone, Maine. The device proved capable of
ascending to heights of over 100 metres and harvesting power from more
rapid air currents before returning to the earth in an automated cycle.

The technology could radically enhance the efficiency of wind turbines,
given that air speeds are directly proportional to both altitude and
energy harvesting. The air currents harvested by the BAT-Buoyant 300
metres above Fairbanks are expected to be between five to eight times
stronger than those at sea-level, and Altaeros claims the device could
reduce generation costs by as much as 65 per cent.

While engineers in the wind power industry are striving to devise new
methods for raising the height of turbines, the use of airborne podiums
could obviate the manifold challenges involved in building taller towers
– an engineering task fraught with considerable difficulty.

BAT’s developers see the flying turbines vastly increasing the
convenience of wind power deployment by dispensing with the need to
occupy extensive tracts of land and build fixed infrastructure assets.

“For decades, wind turbines have required cranes and huge towers to lift
a few hundred feet off the ground where winds can be slow and gusty,”
said Ben Glass, inventor of the airborne wind turbine. “We are excited
to demonstrate that modern inflatable materials can lift wind turbines
into more powerful winds almost everywhere—with a platform that is cost
competitive and easy to setup from a shipping container.”

The turbines could also alleviate concerns about the the potential for
intrusive or hazardous noise pollution created by wind turbines situated
in close proximity to residential areas, and the impact of land-based
towers upon terrestrial ecosystems.

In addition to achieving enhanced energy harvesting, the airborne
devices are also capable of a swathe of other functions, including the
provision of data coverage and telecommunication services, and the
monitoring of local weather conditions.

Published on 31 October 2014
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15872 From: dave santos Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: Sept. TUDelft AWE Gathering (EU "mission-accomplished" AWE science p

Strange how we miss learning of these event "invitations" in real time, but better-late-than-never. Here is re-confirmation of the common EU AWE belief that our "major scientific advances" are accomplished, and what remains is mostly just "reliability, robustness, and material durability". This is Mario's general position, and the group-think of the elite EU reeling club down-select is very striking. The competing view is that the single-unit reeling club has overlooked key concepts emerging in Open AWE, and is in danger of missing the real party (GW unit scale). Its a very exciting difference of engineering opinion. We also note the e-kite debutante on early display.


from- http://www.kitepower.eu/


INVITATION

The faculties of Aerospace Engineering (AE), Mechanical, Maritime and Material Engineering (3ME), Civil Engineering and Geo-sciences (CEG), Electrical Engineering, Mathematics and Computer Sciences (EEMCS) and Technology Policy and Management (TPM) invite to join this activity of the TU Delft Wind Energy Institute (DUWind).

This academic year 2014-2015 DUWind organises a monthly Thursday-gathering called Duwind op Donderdag (DoD). Anybody considering him- or herself as part of the wind energy community is warmly invited to join and meet like-minded colleagues, fellow students and other interested people. Different subjects and activities will have the floor, all related to research, education and/or industry in the broad and dynamic world of wind energy.

The upcoming event will be focussed on Airborne Wind Energy & Kite Power Generation.

TwingTec, Dübendorf, Switzerland Ampyx Power, Den Haag, The Netherlands TU Delft, The Netherlands E-Kite, Barneveld, The Netherlands

Date and time: 18 September 2014, 17.30-21.00, walking dinner included.

Location: Faculty of Aerospace Engineering, Room D.

Airborne wind energy concepts employ tethered flying devices such as wings or balloons to harvest wind energy. The tether is used to transfer either traction power or onboard-generated electricity to the ground. A central driving force for the development of the various technologies is the substantial material reduction that can be achieved by substituting tower and foundation of conventional wind turbines by a lightweight tether and ground anchor. Another attractive feature is the operational adaptability to the available wind conditions, including altitude.

About 50 professional R&D activities on airborne wind energy can be counted today, of which 50% have reached a serious prototype stage. Prominent examples are the German company SkySails, which markets a traction-assist solution for container ships with wings of up to 320 m2 wing surface area, and the Californian company Makani Power, which was acquired in 2013 by Google and is currently building the M600, a prototype wing of 30 m wing span generating 600 kW. Major scientific advances have been in the fields of control and automation while the current technological challenges appear to shift towards operational reliability, robustness and material durability.

The objective of this event is to introduce the technology and to discuss a subset of representative projects, focusing on the developments in the Netherlands and Switzerland. Speakers will be Dr. Rolf Luchsinger, Managing Director of TwingTec, Dübendorf (CH), Alfred van den Brink, Technical Director of E-Kite, Barneveld (NL), Dr. Michiel Kruijff, Head of Product Development of Ampyx Power, Den Haag (NL), Dr. Henk Polinder, Associate Professor and expert on electrical machines at the EEMCS faculty of TU Delft and Dr. Roland Schmehl, Associate Professor and Head of the Kite Power Research Group at the AE faculty of TU Delft.


Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15873 From: Joe Faust Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: At EPFL
  • Real-Time Optimization for Kites
    ​              ​

    Sean Costello∗ Gr ́egory Fran ̧cois∗ Dominique Bonvin
    ​*​     
    ∗ E ́cole Polytechnique Federale de Lausanne, Switzerland 
  •  
    • Kite power systems
    • Autonomous Airborne Wind Energy (A2WE) Project
      ​; 
    • SNSF Project A2WE : 2013- 2017
  • Kite Control - A Benchmark Problem for Advanced Control and Dynamic Optimization.

  • Costello, Sean; François, Grégory; Bonvin, Dominique

    Submitted to: Control Engineering Practice (ISSN: 0967-0661)
    Elsevier, 2014
    ​Full paper in PDF.​
​Since this note does not reach all kite matters at EPFL, those working at EPFL are here openly invited to tell us more!

~ JoeF​


Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15874 From: Joe Faust Date: 11/4/2014
Subject: KitePower Publications at TU Delft
PUBLICATIONS
​re: KitePower concerns at TU Delft

Each paper could be a dedicated discussion topic as interest beckons. 

~ JoeF

Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15875 From: stephane rousson Date: 11/5/2014
Subject: l' Aerosail soutenu par Redbull !
Attachments :
    Bonjour à Tous, Good news !

    Redbull soutien le projet Aerosail dans son magazine au niveau international :

    Merci de partager un maximum sur tout vos réseaux sociaux !!
    Nous avons besoin d’un beau sponsor pour continuer cette superbe aventure !






    et une superbe video sur le travail que je mène depuis plus de 10 ans


    Bonne journée à vous tous

    -- Images intégrées 1
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15876 From: mmarchitti Date: 11/5/2014
    Subject: Re: KitVes
    The standard I spoke of is a de facto standard, that was set in 2006, then all the promising companies I listed followed/copied. There are no authorities that declare a standard, it is the circumstances that do that, as happened for the mainframe with IBM, or, since recently, for MS for the PC Operating system.

    Actually after 2006-8 I have not seen appreceable results in High Wind Energy system development. It is also to be said that probably companies do not show their results to the general public, either there are certain development that cannot be seen, as for example the development of the software for the control.

    As I said, one of the very problems in High Wind Energy is a professional industrial organization, a sound management. Political and government have culturally and technically collapsed, therefore it is very difficult to think of a Manhattan or Apollo project for the High Wind Energy system. 

    Also in the ellenistic period there were attempts to use the steam energy (I do not mean Erone) but with arrival of the Roman empire that technology was forgotten, and we had to wait thousand years to see that energy again. I hope not to wait for thousand years to see and use the High Wind Energy.

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    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15877 From: Joe Faust Date: 11/5/2014
    Subject: Re: KitVes
    "that was set in 2006"
    ​      Won't hold! Look to earlier times.​

    Why not say set in 1970s, at least, if not earlier!  Those in the 2006
    were not the first, as they copied known prior method. Standard (?)
    methods of AWES were known, published, and tried far before 2006.  
    To
    ​ ​
    hold the 2006 plays as setting standards is to under-value
    the 
    earlier 
    AWE
    mothers and fathers. Just spending more money does not merit origin
    merit or standard
    ​-​
    setting merit.  There are various qualities of
    standards
    ​:​
    poor, good enough, good, excellent, ...  One way to sense
    seeding of standards is to master the AWE tech embedded in the decade
    of 1970-1979, at least.
    ​     ​
    Just mastering Payne and McCutcheon would be a neat start. It is
    understood how a team or a newbie would well up in pride and see AWE
    center in themselves; excitement may do such wonders, but historically
    blinding to earlier public-domain art might signal a kind of blinders
    that will miss that which might be needed to effect widespread AWES
    adoption.

        Perhaps with Open-AWE and Internet and other new communication
    tools, there could be a new kind of Manhattan AWE Project to effect GW
    AWES.
     Maybe a new name:  World AWE Project (WAP).​


    ~ JoeF
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15878 From: dave santos Date: 11/5/2014
    Subject: Re: KitVes
    Mario,

    Thanks for the comments. These topics have been often discussed during the last five years. The de facto AWE standard you note is specific only to groundgens and softkites (since NTS is not based on reeling method). There is no AWE system-wide standard yet. We recall the Wright Flyers were catapult-launched bi-plane pusher-prop canards, rather than the standard aircraft that finally emerged. As an AWES standard does emerge, it will also be shaped and formalized to FAA/ICAO, ISO, CE, etc. standards; a long process hardly begun.

    The slowness of the Ancien Regime (US-EU decision-makers) to create a major AWE project is natural, and may end quickly when we show better prototypes. Meanwhile, we have a nice global Open-AWE movement based on the Net, with the biggest scope of talent and diversity (and craziness). For now, its up to us to create solutions, not the job of government or corporate types. "Professional industrial organization [and] sound management" can come later.

    JoeF is rightly invokes to Payne and McCutcheon as the Open-AWE choice of de facto standard. Unlike the ventures you list, they represent essential technical advantages of crosswind flight (without downwind travel and retract-phase loss) (Payne even identified the kite-arch topology with passive short-stroke oscillation). We have added modular array ideas for highest capacity density and greatest scaling potential. The latest trend is isotropic kite domes for ultimate scaling. The EU reeling club is chasing MW unit-scale, when the new game is GW unit-scale. The reeling club is still struggling with active control of what open AWE does passively (ie. yaw-stability).

    The elite but self-isolated EU reeling club has done us a fine service in establishing a baseline performance standard for the Open-AWE ideas to beat, if they can. The AWE race is not over; its only just begun to warm up,

    daveS


    On Wednesday, November 5, 2014 3:23 AM, "marchitti@hotmail.com [AirborneWindEnergy]" <AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15879 From: Pierre BENHAIEM Date: 11/5/2014
    Subject: Re: KitVes

    And MarioM wrote :"Actually after 2006-8 I have not seen appreceable results in High Wind Energy system development." It is because the current projects are not economically viable: multiplying unities into farm by HAWT model is multiplying tethers going crosswind involving a huge land and space used, and a basis of active control for trajectories.On www.nrel.gov/wind/pdfs/49409.pdf Dr Fort Felker rightly mentions :"Increased cost of project financing for immature technologies can be fatal". Nor a good system should work on a basis of passive control, active control completing passive control not for trajectories involving a supplementary layer of risk, but as mean of adaptation to wind changes. So a good system should be more or less stationary in the whole, some integrated elements working as WECS.  

    PierreB

    http://flygenkite.com

    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15880 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 11/5/2014
    Subject: AWE Community Collaboration

    This topic thread invites noting ways the AWE Community is collaborating, ways we might collaborate further, and challenges on the same. 

    ====================================


    Start: 

    1. May each team have at least one active member communicating in this AirborneWindEnergy forum. Perhaps a minimum of one post per month?  Be here to advance AWE RAD, not the least by advancing the "getting to know you" space.   If stealth bent, still consider ways of being present and active. Job opportunities, talks, events, safety notes, ideas aside of proprietary matters, changes in team, sites, incidents, claims, history, ..

    2. 

    ~ JoeF


    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15881 From: dave santos Date: 11/5/2014
    Subject: Re: KitVes
    Pierre makes some assumptions that fit the facts and some that don't. He seems to presume Mario is correct about 2008 somehow being a dead-end milestone, strangely implying that AWE only became economically nonviable after that date. In fact, since 2008 more money has poured into AWE R&D than the entire history before, and I personally know several AWE millionaires made long after 2008. 2008 seems like an imaginary dividing line, if no one can expain it clearly.

    Pierre once again disregards our aerospace R&D niche as "not economically viable", but it really is to the pro developer community. There is no sign that AWE R&D funding is slowing; New GoogleX funding by itself is enough to prove funding is growing, and we count a long list of large new players, like German investment banks, major oil companies, and other serious players. These investments are current, with no sign of abating. AWE could well enter energy markets by consistently growing R&D funds, if the established trend holds.

    Pierre is right in agreeing that there are better AWES architectures known than Mario's "de facto standard", but Pierre tends to overestimate the airspace capacity density problem as the major design driver. Most of the world's airspace is wide open, with no over-crowding imminent, and KLG has presented fundamental dense array solutions in detail, for seven years now. 

    Pierre also seems to overlook that no one is proposing purely passive AWES for large scale generation. KLG thinking is to apply passive-stability design features, along with autopilot systems; but supervised by FAA required pilot and observer (PIC and VO) crews (three layers of control). KLG-identified passive-stability factors are a competitive safety-critical edge added to manual and autonomous flight controls, just as economically viable aircraft traditionally have inherent passive-stabilities (fighter-jets as the exception, if you allow military spending as economically viable).




    On Wednesday, November 5, 2014 12:39 PM, "Pierre BENHAIEM pierre.benhaiem@orange.fr [AirborneWindEnergy]" <AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15882 From: dave santos Date: 11/5/2014
    Subject: Essential Flight Stability for AWES
    Two opposed camps are seen in AWES design with regard to flight stability. At one extreme is Makani and Aympx, whose kite planes will fall out of the sky with any interruption of active control, and at the other extreme is Altaeros and Magenn, whose AWES remain flying without active control, even in calm.  A successful AWES must be safe and survive to pay-back, and KLG/kPower proposes that every available stability principle, (passive, active (manual and auto)) will help the winning designs first reach utility market milestones. The engineering magic of inherent flight stability is not just that it enhances manual- and auto-piloting, but that it does so almost "for free", since its really just the wise disposition and setting of airfoils, so that essential flight stability is far safer and easier-

    To reduce misunderstanding about whether inherent (passive) flight stability is optional or essential to "standard" AWES, its important to fully understand the established aeronautical fundamentals. Then one can fairly credit how clever passive-control AWES designs are (eg. they can fly Pierre's FlyGen without him)-


    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15883 From: dave santos Date: 11/5/2014
    Subject: Re: AWE Community Collaboration
    JoeF,

    Nice invitation; looking forward to the new voices with new ideas. If only the AWE stealth ventures had something to gain by entering into public dialogue with Open-AWE peers. The Ivory Tower is another social challenge.

    Many stealth players will only message us behind-the-scenes. Some dread being attacked in public, rocking delicate investor relations. We are asking them to risk public attacks by withering logic (or toxic-troll attacks). We know these players are not protecting "secret sauce", but hiding human weaknesses, and uncontrolled debate easily sours their already slim chances. There is a real conflict between AWE science and established venture culture.

    Many academic players are socially isolated from open forums by immersion in a very intense merit-culture of their own. Some hardly know Open-AWE even exists and none of them need to be distracted from serious mind-work by a motley pack of characters. At best we reach them by manifest merit, if we are not able to conform to their own elite public protocols. Again, we network with them off-Forum, and dragging them into the circus is not productive. Lets be content that AWE academia at least shares domain knowledge on its own terms, by noble principles, if not as promiscuously as the AWES Forum.

    As the would-be nexus of AWE knowledge, we get to play all tracks, the raucous public Net, and the discreet inside channels, and its quite proper to invite more participation and not expect a stampede. Everything will change when a clear winner emerges, and defines the dominant model. If Open-AWE wins big, then everyone will want to be seen with us ; )

    daveS




    On Wednesday, November 5, 2014 4:19 PM, "joefaust333@gmail.com [AirborneWindEnergy]" <AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15884 From: Pierre BENHAIEM Date: 11/5/2014
    Subject: Re: KitVes



    Since some years the companies quoted by MarioM (adding also some others like Makani) received more money. So year after year there are elements of prove of non viability by the lack of seen progress, that among a progression of general R&D in AWE. So there are progresses in some AWE fields while current architectures do not work (a moving forest of crosswind tethers does not make any solution, even with more and more money). The AWE standard has to be built.

     

    PierreB

    http://flygenkite.com

     

     

    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15885 From: Pierre BENHAIEM Date: 11/5/2014
    Subject: Re: Essential Flight Stability for AWES

    Sky Windpower is an excellent example of passive control for both flying and generation. The last scheme I develop goes towards integration of tilted rotors into soft wing increasing lightness/AWES area and separating rotors,avoiding touching, the good surprise of last tests being important supplement of power on rotors by soft wing arround.

    PierreB

    http://flygenkite.com showing in first the last scheme as passive stationary FlygenKite towards utility scale (passive control of stationary flying system + passive control of generation by rotors); then in second the manually controled (active control) crosswind FlygenKite as a prove of non viability for generation at scale (forest of tethers, no maximization of space used, not safe enough), the advantage of "crosswing kite" becoming a disadvantage by the space and land used., and the lack of inherent safety. 

    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15886 From: Rod Read Date: 11/6/2014
    Subject: kite winch anchoring
    For my kite anchor field test on the rocky lunar looking Isle of Harris, I'll be using some of the worlds most ancient granites for anchoring.
    For hardware fixing into these rocks it seems too coincident that rock kite cement is the stuff. http://www.rockitecement.com/
    Good spec going for it though.

    Anyone got advice on preferred kite winch / hoist strategies?

    Each kite will be individually controlled with a hoist (or cheaper winch if I can) from the ground.
    The max load expected (including possible shock loading) will not be more than 200kg on each line.
    I would like to use lightweight dyneema line on the spool.
    Line length 20m minimum.
    Preferably using a remotely operable lower voltage system for outdoor use with a good IP rating 54 or over.

    A solid beam or frame mounting is probably preferable to an in-line winch.
    Any solution will need a good fairlead off the drum, as the lifting angle will roam around the ground azimuth plane at about 60deg (+-25deg) from horizontal.

    As we move toward man-lifting applications then (with EU regulations ) winches are out of the question. Numerous extra safety features are included in hoist equipment.

    110v 250Kg Scaffold Hoist
    Warn Pullzall 230v - Corded Version
    Rod Read

    Windswept and Interesting Limited
    15a Aiginis
    Isle of Lewis
    UK
    HS2 0PB

    07899057227
    01851 870878

    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15887 From: dave santos Date: 11/6/2014
    Subject: Re: Essential Flight Stability for AWES
    Pierre,

    SkyWindPower is not the best textbook example of inherent flight stability because of the lack of public data logged over many flight hours. If this data exists, my prediction is that it shows the same instabilities (or weak stabilities) that other quad-copters show, plus the perturbative effects of tethers and wind. 

    We have come to appreciate the essential role of kite-tail and "keel" area in stable kites (provided by fuselage and empennage in conventional aircraft, for stable side-slip), but the SkyWindPower as an aircraft is very different. Its known that autogyro kites are not models of high inherent stability. Quadcopters are also operationally vulnerable to rotor damage that destroys stability, compared to simpler soft kites. An unshrouded rotor has a potential to foul with tethers, as its own inherent system instability factor, even if its flight dynamics really were a model of "Essential Flight Stability". Maybe you have solved these issues, as we will soon see.

    Of course conventional aircraft and kite stability is far better validated as the "gold standard" of flight stability, so we await careful test results before elevating the quad-rotor platform to the same status. If you have supportive quad-rotor inherent-stability data to share, please do,

    daveS




    On Wednesday, November 5, 2014 9:08 PM, "Pierre BENHAIEM pierre.benhaiem@orange.fr [AirborneWindEnergy]" <AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15888 From: dave santos Date: 11/6/2014
    Subject: Re: KitVes
    Pierre wrote: "prove of non viability by the lack of seen progress"

    This is fortunately  illogical twice over. A lack of visible progress cannot prove non-viability.* 

    In AWE, the kite and aerospace experts see consistent progress by many metrics (TRL, critical-path-analysis, power, altitude, endurance, regulatory compliance, knowledge advances, etc.). Non-viability can only be soundly concluded if the serious developers all finish in failure, but they are all moving forward. Anyone who wants to see the progress just has to understand trend metrics. The experts know the reasons that R&D takes due time to blossom. For examples, scaling-up safely is not a hasty engineering process, nor is finding optimal system designs. There are also business delays. These are normal conditions of eventual success.


    * Something is still very strange about Pierre claiming AWE "non viability", while also marketing his AWE patents to investors. How can such an investment be viable?




    On Wednesday, November 5, 2014 8:38 PM, "Pierre BENHAIEM pierre.benhaiem@orange.fr [AirborneWindEnergy]" <AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15889 From: Joe Faust Date: 11/6/2014
    Subject: Tethers Serving and Generating?
    Tethers Serving and Generating?
           Avoiding "functional fixedness" as regards tethers, exploring tethers as the site for service and generation of energy formats is the topic herein.  There is robust attention on kite-system tethers for the practiced function of traction, of causing shafts to turn, and for holding flygens aloft; those functions are being followed and furthered for good reasons. Fine; but herein reach for how kite-system tethers may be the direct site for other services and other energy-generation services.  Have long tethers serve all along their lengths. Put the forest of tethers to work, to fulfill valuable purpose, and to generate electricity.

           First, some teasers. Later, all others from all camps are invited to brainstorm about the present topic. And then to sift, extend, develop, sideline, prioritize, appraise, ...      And watch for tether-site matters that might join extant AWES concerns
    • Illuminated tethers
      ​. Reflective tethers. Airspace fencing. 
    • Lamp-saturated tethers for lighting aerial or ground scenes
    • Net tethers. Insect collectors. Water collectors. Recreation realm. Catch pilots and technicians. 
    • ​Ladder-way tether
    • Curtain-hang.   
    • Multiple lines hung from tether.
    • Tethers hanging curtains to generate shade
    • Move materials along tethers' exterior
      ​   (fluids, gases, solids, people, animals, fish, seeds, water, cloud-seeding materials, ... )​
    • Move materials along tethers' interior
    • Move materials along tethers' interior and exterior. 
    • Move vibrations via tethers. 
    • Move electricity via tethers. 
    • Move communication signals via tethers. 
    • Hold things on tethers. 
    • Have tethers be compound loops that has the tether half going up and half the tether going down. 
    • Have tether stations serve station and altitude-station service. 
    • How to generate electricity all along the tether set ?
    • ​Sensor-saturated tethers for art, science, recreation, government, ...  What to sense? Air parameters, temperatures, wind, motion, visible scenes, traffic, tether status, noise, moisture, 
    • Have linear electric generators ride-sail up and down the tether-as-stator. 
    • As priorly noted: Shuttle batteries for charging aloft. 
    • Exercise machine: the tether. High bar. Jumper. Barrier for jumping. ​Resistance pressing. Holder of flying trapeze; holder of nets for such activity. 

    • Have outlets along the tether length of pipe tethers; let some material be released from the outlets all along the tether. Perhaps smartly schedule releases from chosen outlets. 
    • Maybe have lifter kite wings fully dedicated to holding multiple tethers where the tether stations are in focus for service and generation of desired results. 
    • Pumping piezoelectric tether: Have tether-tension oscillations be put to direct electricity production. 
    • Antenna, a centuries-old tether purpose. Transmit. Receive.
    • Line-lifters along tethers might have multiple functions (line lift to aid the global AWES, station service of conspicuity, station service via one more more of the possible functions found in this topic discussion or elsewhere).
    • ​Saturate an airspace with working tethers. Moan no more about the land and airspace cost of forest of tethers; rather, find ways to have the very tethers be the service and production site. Turn a formerly perceived parasite into a productive member of AWES.   How?
    ​All are welcome to continue the exploratory phase​.  And develop tether systems and services in Open-AWE or Stealth-AWE or Academic-AWE, or some in each!  Help others see what you see about purposing kite-system tethers. 


    ~ JoeF
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15890 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 11/6/2014
    Subject: Re: kite winch anchoring
    Still studying your interesting post, Rod. This note is places, else I might lose the share: 
    Consider the Chinese finger handcuff net to grab ambient bolders; tether to one end. 


    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15891 From: Joe Faust Date: 11/6/2014
    Subject: Rock Kiting
    Rock Kiting
    • Rocks as kite-system parts:  As a kite system has anchor set, tether set, and wing set, it can be noticed that one may focus on using ambient rocks in the anchor set of the the kite system. That is, the rocks become part of the kite system. This is not new; tiny rocks in sand bags are well used anchor parts to kite systems. And in reel-less AWES operations, large rocks and concrete blocks are used.  One may anchor-involve many separate rocks with lines gathered to a ring or continued through to main tether set for resisting the kite-system's wing set. 

    • Dropping rocks from AWES:  
      • Want to crush something with rocks? 
      • Want to move rocks from one place to another? 
      • Want to drop rocks to break the rocks into smaller rocks? 
    • Want to drag a rock to move it?  
      • Want to drag a rock to clear weeds
      • To clear land or 
      • Demolish a structure? 
      • To set off land mines?
      • Build dams
      • Build plateus to be above flood levels

    • Swing rocks to demolish structures
    • Have rocks as the mass to be kite moved up and down a rail while generating electricity. 
    • Move rocks to ore-processing sites. 
    • ...
    Other rock-kiting notes may be massaged in this topic thread. Rock-kiting project reports? Commercial efforts?  
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15892 From: dave santos Date: 11/6/2014
    Subject: Conductive AWES Stages
    This is related to JoeF's current tether topic, but was already in gestation as its own topic-

    It been proposed that the problem of lofting flygens to higher altitude can be mitigated by creating Conductive AWES Stages in the form of elevated junctions and "ground-planes". These massive infrastructure stages would host their own lifting surfaces, and only rise as nominal conditions exist, and land first as wind slacks.

    A next step in considering discreet conductive stages is to see that upper conductors can be specified relatively thinner in cooler upper air, particularly the short fast-moving segment terminating at a turbine-on-a-wing, due to fast-motion air-cooling. Optimal tether design for a flygen kiteplane AWES would therefore taper its conductive cross-section from base to top. A short final stage conductive tether section, inspected and replaced on a shorter cycle than the rest of the tether, could minimize conductive tether drag and mass, with an acceptable safety factor.

    CC+ 4.x BY NC+ SA
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15893 From: dave santos Date: 11/6/2014
    Subject: What is a "Kite-Mesh"? (disambiguation) What is it good for?
    We have loosely used the term "kite mesh" in past years, depending on a vague consensual understanding of what meshes are, but a more precise definition is wanted, to make sure we are communicating novel kite lattice concepts clearly.

    Let a Kite-Mesh be defined a tesselated 2D plane* of unit-sails (but not a 3D lattice (a "foam")), nor a string-only net, nor a continuous sail membrane). Under this definition, many popular kites with open ribbon-woven sails and vent-network patterns (typically for high wind) have a Kite-Mesh character. The working hypothesis is that such meshes can beneficially reduce the Re characteristic-dimension (by fractal dimension metric) and related high-velocity and large characteristic-dimension** flight instabilities. This more a concept of current art than settled AE science.

    It is proposed that Kite-Mesh comprised of a tesselation pattern of triangular sails well-spaced on a hex grid (with a fractal dimension around 1.3) will be a highly scalable kite form of "programmable matter". A secondary network of tag-lines can modulate the phase (directional tilting) of the sails, for isotropic kite domes.

    CC+ 4.x BY NC+ SA



    * disregarding warping of the plane

    ** in dimensionless time (large aerostructures act more slowly in dimensional time and experience a slower dimensionless-velocity)
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15894 From: Rod Read Date: 11/6/2014
    Subject: Re: Tethers Serving and Generating?
    I think you left out mention of using the tether as axis guide for torque generating or transmitting  devices.


    Rod Read

    Windswept and Interesting Limited
    15a Aiginis
    Isle of Lewis
    UK
    HS2 0PB

    07899057227
    01851 870878


    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15895 From: Rod Read Date: 11/6/2014
    Subject: Re: kite winch anchoring
    I have stropped off large rocks as anchor to my flying daisy generator ... dodgy.
    This time I want something a bit less ropey ... (e.g.  not rubbing over rock surfaces geting abraded.)
    A winch mounting fixed into bedrock (maybe on a UJ or gimbal) with fairlead  able to reliably service an upper hemisphere of tension possibilities ... That's what I'm after next.


    Rod Read

    Windswept and Interesting Limited
    15a Aiginis
    Isle of Lewis
    UK
    HS2 0PB

    07899057227
    01851 870878


    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15896 From: Pierre BENHAIEM Date: 11/6/2014
    Subject: Re: KitVes

     

    The complete quotation is :" So year after year there are elements of prove of non viability by the lack of seen progress, that among a progression of general R&D in AWE."  PierreB

     



    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15897 From: dave santos Date: 11/6/2014
    Subject: Re: KitVes
    Pierre, 

    The complete quote is even less comprehensible, and to merely repeat it (without clarification) is really not helpful. Keep in mind there may be some translation error you are not aware of, since we are stuck with the same deep confusion, for a long time now.

    Lets get this topic back to KitVes, if you prefer not explaining the contradiction you raise every time you declare AWE is somehow not economically viable while actively seeking investors. Please offer clear definitions in context (for "non-viable" and "economic"), and real proofs (that a third-party domain engineer would accept). Otherwise, it just looks like persistent aggravated confirmation bias; of two mutually exclusive personal biases (that AWE is non-viable, except if its a scheme you patented).

    Does anyone support you in these mutually-exclusive claims, who can explain the logic clearly? How about sharing some photos or videos of your successful experiments?

    daveS



    On Thursday, November 6, 2014 1:40 PM, "Pierre BENHAIEM pierre.benhaiem@orange.fr [AirborneWindEnergy]" <AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15898 From: Rod Read Date: 11/6/2014
    Subject: Whale baleen as AWES power model
    If you look at the size of engine pushing whale baleen through the water.
    2.5 MW – biomed: peak power output of a blue whale
    Studying the form of baleen you see how their fractal structure densely resists water flow in a wide set of flow crushing surfaces bladed to fill an expandable arch.

    Study the frontal area of a whales' gob.
    Consider the speed of a whale and the density of it's medium.
    Scale that form of arch and infill to kites in air.

    Consider further complimentary fractal frond like structures, with blades and trunk ring forms like palm trees yet set able to rotate and augment the arch energy harvesting diversity.

    Consider printing and fusing techniques to work with plastic laminations in order to form desirable yet similar build surfaces. As proven in the marine environment...

    or

    Recycle washed up whales to make kite generators by tying them as SFES.
    Seaborne Flow Energy Systems

    And keep modelling with that method.
    CC4.0 nc by sa plusses

    Rod Read

    Windswept and Interesting Limited
    15a Aiginis
    Isle of Lewis
    UK
    HS2 0PB

    07899057227
    01851 870878

    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15900 From: Rod Read Date: 11/6/2014
    Subject: Re: Whale baleen as AWES power model
    Do you have a directional awes airframe able to reliably tow a whale mouth along the ocean?

    Rod Read

    Windswept and Interesting Limited
    15a Aiginis
    Isle of Lewis
    UK
    HS2 0PB

    07899057227
    01851 870878


    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15901 From: joe_f_90032 Date: 11/6/2014
    Subject: Powered Aircraft Pilots on Parker Ranch Airspace

    Some powered aircraft pilots perk up about Google's Makani Power's use of the airspace over Parker Ranch:


    Posted November 6, 2014
    Makani: Wind kite not a hazard to aircraft

    By Bret Yager

    - See more at: http://westhawaiitoday.com/news/local-news/makani-wind-kite-not-hazard-aircraft#sthash.KP2QDuLz.dpuf


    Points mentioned:

    • Tether visibility
    • Tether visibility during the night
    • Tether visibility during fog
    • Airspace used by powered aircraft
    • "The kite will be located about 5 miles south of the Waimea Airport"
    • Tether visibility during the night
    • Tether visibility during fog
    • Airspace used by powered aircraft
    • Lighted wing of the kite system
    • Night flying of the kite system wanted by MP.
    • Kite system to be manned continuously. 
    • Kite system reaches 1,100 ft altitude [article did not specify AGL, but probably intended]
    • The kite system rating will be the 600 kw version. 
    • Flight intended for the 600 kw is planned for 2015.  Month was not mentioned. 
    • Duration of test period would be during a year's time. Then the system would be decommissioned. 
    • Powered-aircraft pilot fixation on the seen wing of the kite system could be a challenge; such fixation on the wing might have powered aircraft pilots missed seeing or even knowing that the seen kite system wing had a tether involved. 
    • On smaller kite system by MP:  some 10-hr flights
    • MP favors the Parker Ranch wind-direction-change scene for a richer test experience. 
    ~ JoeF
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15902 From: dave santos Date: 11/6/2014
    Subject: Re: KitVes
    My impression of KitVes is that very little useful has resulted from the money. There is a tendency (which I have directly observed) in the Italian (and US Bay Area) AWES developer circles to throw a marathon party with investment funding, with some (but not too much) engineering mixed in. Guess who may not be first across the the finish-line (but what a fantastic time, while it lasts).

    ==============

    Pierre: Be more concerned about the lost KitVes topic, and for all the readers, before posting humour-banal. Let the technical questions to you remain unaddressed then. We are all to post on topic and cut message tails as best we can. This is not a bavarder-room. Sorry to annoy you.


    On Thursday, November 6, 2014 2:49 PM, "Pierre BENHAIEM pierre.benhaiem@orange.fr [AirborneWindEnergy]" <AirborneWindEnergy@yahoogroups.com
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15903 From: dave santos Date: 11/6/2014
    Subject: Re: Powered Aircraft Pilots on Parker Ranch Airspace
    Wow, they are really piling on the engineering risks. Maiden flying an experimental jumbo E-VTOL at over four thousand feet, in doubly-thin warm tropical air, with mountains causing large eddies, elite NIMBY backlash potential. Google can pretend its all-good, not rather alarming. Only the Hawaiian lifestyle is secured.

    In the afterglow of two commercial rocket disasters in one week, the M600 is sure looking like the latest Jumbo E-flight "traditional Hawaiian Luau", beyond even Helios-



    "The investigation report identified a two-part root cause of the (Helios) accident:
    1. "Lack of adequate analysis methods led to an inaccurate risk assessment of the effects of configuration changes leading to an inappropriate decision to fly an aircraft configuration highly sensitive to disturbances."
    2. "Configuration changes to the aircraft, driven by programmatic and technological constraints, altered the aircraft from a spanloader to a highly point-loaded mass distribution on the same structure significantly reducing design robustness and margins of safety."[3]"

     
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15904 From: Joe Faust Date: 11/6/2014
    Subject: Re: Powered Aircraft Pilots on Parker Ranch Airspace
    ​Makani Team is aiming ​to ship out the 600 kW energy kite to Hawaii before their target start next summer 2015.
    ~ Upper WindPower
    Group: AirborneWindEnergy Message: 15905 From: benhaiemp Date: 11/6/2014
    Subject: Re: AWES for electricity production in utility-scale? Turbines integ

    DaveS wrote: "Let the technical questions to you remain unaddressed then. ".Below is a previous post for some technical questions, confirmed by last tests. I precise I see the present AWE Forum as a forum for discussion, not for making some "open" collaborative AWES which is not really possible and rather a loss of time because of the lack of intellectual rigour preventing some constructive discussion, all I write being deformed or cutted by....guess who? So I confirm I will not communicate the details of tests on the forum, for the present topic, but also for other topics involving my R&D. I have time only for tests and R&D.     

    "Some tests I just realized in free air are confirming DougS's hypothesis. So said tests also counter pessimist statements from DaveS about global loss of power by chocked flow.

    I shall stop giving more details on the forum about R&D related in the present  topic, until a correct ethical and technical voice is the prevailing tone of the present forum.

     

    PierreB

    http://flygenkite.com     

     

    Below the message 6 from DougS with underlined hypothesis: "

    "embedding rotors into wing sail bodies has a cost of increased blunt-body stream-stagnation tendency;" ***Are you sure about that?
    " the wind will tend to see the whole sail as the barrier to flow around; embedded rotors get cheated some. Just how much PTO is reduced by tight-border embedding of rotors as opposed to rotors set in free stream is something designers will care about."~ JoeF
    *** I'm not convinced an embedded rotor has any less power, and I'd say it might even enjoy more power.  I could imagine the kite might function to force more air through the rotor.  You're stating this "cost" as though you are stating something factual.  Do you have any evidence, or is this just an offhand momentary opinion?""
     
    Last tests show DougS is right, and JoeF and DaveS are wrong.
     
    PierreB
     
    NB: Is DougS censored in the present forum?